JJA C4 Reviews!

@rocketman69 20,5 inches is 52cm, that's quite narrow for me.  I am running 56cm (20,5 inches).  Again, I'm 6,3" (187cm) and about 190lbs (85kg), size US13 Softboot. I'll try experimenting with my stance, but just curious about you other trench diggers, what are you riding?  Might be good as a reference to compair.  Also, curious about offset and what others have found.  Of course it's all board specific, but could be a good place to start, especially when considering a C4.

I’m 5’8” (actually not quite anymore) with 49 cm to the centre of my kneecap.  I ride a 52-54cm stance width, no canting or lift.

Posted by: @bigwasabi

↑

Also, curious about offset and what others have found.  Of course it's all board specific, but could be a good place to start, especially when considering a C4.

Hey @bigwasabi,

When you're asking about "offset" I presume you're referring to what has been called "bias", which is the sliding of the individual bindings from a centered position towards one of the edges, right?

So to minimize boot drag it's usually recommended to center each binding between the edges, leaving the same gap (whether that be overhang or underhang) on both sides.  However, because of the shape of the board, both the sidecut and the taper, what you would end up with is the rear binding biased (or offset) towards the heel edge because the board is wider near the heel of the back foot than the toe (assuming POSI POSI angles of course).  And the opposite is true with the front foot; the board is wider where the front toe sits versus the front heel, so that binding would be set closer to the toe edge.

Imagine a center line drawn down the board.  By centering your bindings equidistant from the edges where they sit, you end up sliding the rear binding towards the heel and the front binding towards the toe edge.  This position (let's call it centered, with no offset/bias) would minimize boot drag.  With me so far?

Now...  Stand on your floor in a POSI POSI soft boot stance like 30/15 or close, or imagine it at least.  In this position the further you slide your back foot in the heel direction the less stable your stance becomes, but the further you slide that back foot in the direction of your toes the more stable and natural that stance becomes.

So...  To minimize boot drag (by centering your bindings between the edges) you have to compromise your stable athletic stance.  Centering the bindings on an imaginary center line down the board yields a more stable and balanced position, but you will inevitably suffer more boot drag.

The moral of the story is that tradeoffs always seem necessary and there's no perfect solution...  I would of course prefer to have my rear binding offset towards the toes for stability and to achieve a natural, athletic stance on my board but my toes will drag more.  If I had your size 13 boots and a production "wide" board I doubt I would choose that option.  I would be forced to center my bindings between the edges to minimize drag, I would probably have to use somewhat extreme angles (like @rocketman69), I would definitely use canted risers in that steep stance, and I would want a very very wide board.  I would also make sure to wear the smallest boots I can fit without (too much) discomfort and a rear entry binding too of course, but I already do all of those things with my size 8.5 boots and board widths up to 305 in the waist (except I don't ride extreme angles, rarely above 30/18 though I have ridden 36/21 - which was fine for carving but less comfortable overall and gets awkward when making jump turns or hockey stops; part of the reason I carve soft boots instead of hard is the comfortable and versatile stance angles).

@bigwasabi   The in stock C4s are not your size; the 166s are too soft for your weight and the 162s are just too narrow.  Built list spots are sold out for this batch.  I suggest that you add your name to the waitlist if you haven't already, there seems to be enough rider interest now for that bigger model of C4 and we'll probably do a small run this summer.  Something my like a C4 169 with 300 waist (or larger if possible) and a 13m sidecut.  No promises, but if you're on the waitlist you'll be in the loop for sure and could be carving deep trenches early next season without that aggravating drag.

@wild-cherry Wow man, the level of expertise here is off the chart! Thank you for chiming in, and yes, that's exactly what I meant by offset. 

I have been trying to experiment a bit with it, and to not get such aggressive posi/posi stances as I feel it messes a bit with my balance (not to mention confidence) and I don't have as much control on my board when not carving.  I have a 164 SG Soul Titan XT, with a 280 waist (10,7m sidecut) and use Virus Carbon risers.  This setup has done me well, and I really enjoy the board however I'm curious about stepping up to something wider and what it could do for my carving.  I've never been on a board without some kind of boot out, and feel it gives me an advantage when edging, however at the same time prevents me for going all in deep into the turns.  169 would be next level, a 310-320 waist would also be ideal if I'm going to give this a solid try but that might be too much of a step up from where I'm currently at...  I think it's about what one is familiar with and working with it, I don't want to fiddle too much with it, just set it and adjust myself accordingly.  But if I'm going to switch it up and get a C4, then my logic is to switch it up big.

I'm also here to learn, so please continue everyone to do your writeups and comments, all feedback is much appreciated and I'm soaking it all in.

@bigwasabi

I’ve experimented a lot with snowboard stance width.
I’m 174 cm tall, and my angles are F39 R33.

After watching Japanese carvers, I tried increasing my stance width to 59 cm four years ago.
That was a big mistake because my back knee was under a lot of pressure and became swollen.
After that, I narrowed my stance to 56 cm, but it still felt too wide.

The most important thing I’ve learned about the "posi posi" stance is to narrow it down.
The distance from my heel to the middle of my knee is 52 cm, and that’s the stance width I use now.
It works great for me because I no longer have any knee issues.

Here are a few pictures from this season… Snow wasn't great, but the C4 saved it!

After having ridden the C4 extensively, I can truly say that I have fallen in love with this unique board. After not only having the new board under my feet but also switching to the Flow NX2 (size L), I also experimented with the setup and found a very comfortable setup for me. So, for the stats:

Rider: 75 kg, 172 cm, (short legs), US 9

Stance 52 cm | F27 | R18

I started with F33 | R12, but I noticed that the base of the NX2 is quite wide and by tightening the bootstraps the toes are turned slightly outwards (towards ratchets). 

What I really appreciate and wouldn't want to miss is the waistwidth and the effective edge. Bootout is almost zero for me, and this alone gives me extreme confidence in every turn, and steep slopes start to become really fun. I can really see this season as a big step forward in terms of technique. Firstly, I was boarding regularly, every week, and always concentrating on technique, especially on the heelside, and this combination (board and technique training) is really fun. My impression is that because this board is so well-balanced, it's great for working on your technique.

One thing that shouldn't be underestimated is that you also get full support from the Carvers connection with this board. It took a while to get used to, but the "hip shift" on the heelside is something you have to understand.

But I also let the pictures speak for themselves, the slopes in the video footage were perfect

The slopes here in southern Austria have been very hard, icy, and challenging for most of this season. I'm still working on the steep and very icy slopes, but I'm already getting an idea...
...the C4 162 could actually be an option here. 🤣 

James and JJA have really done something wonderful here 👍 

@vospegmx-at    Fantastic video, and thanks for the review!

I know you didn't ask for feedback but it's just my nature so here goes...

1. Try to get your weight further forward on initiation, you tend to ride the tail too much.  Pressure the nose as you initiate and move back toward the tail to finish your turn.  This will give you more control, especially on steeper terrain.

2.  I'd like to see more of that hip shift rotation on heelside too.  Your back hand is sometimes still flailing over the tail, and that's usually a sign that you're under rotated in the hips. 

Remember the "Steer with your dick!" cue?  It's been updated this season by the original inventor of that phrase...  Now it's "Don't pee on your board!".  The idea is this: imagine that you're pissing while turning toeside.  And now you want to transition to heelside but you don't want to get any pee on your board so you very quickly flop your dick over to the other side and continue pissing there.  The hip movement required for proper heelside initiation is quite similar.  Try it!  (I mean...  not the actual pissing but imagining that you are...)

Posted by: @wild-cherry

↑

I know you didn't ask for feedback but it's just my nature so here goes...

... thank you very much for the feedback, I'm happy to accept it, I was expecting it to some extent. I'll write the comments in my training book; there's still a lot to do. 😀 

Hi guys,

will add some of mine experience.

I'm 190cm, 100 kg, feet US 13. regular +27/+21, riding in the alps approx 2-3 weeks per winter so rather less among other guys here I guess.

Anyway have been riding for quite a long time (25 years), started with the hard boots as a kid and been riding posi posi since I was a kid as I guess that was the only known stance back then.

last 18 years I had the same hardware - board SIMS 160W, still too narrow for anything close to carving carving even its a wide board, lot of boot drag because of the binding and big boots as well.

Last 10 years or so didn't progress anywhere as I was stuck because of hardware limitations and been dreaming about carving. Thought a lot about alpine snowboard + hard boots but never actually went that direction.

Last summer I've discovered this website, YT videos of James carving softboots and started searching for wide boards for softboot carving as this is what I've been draming of for a long time.

Somewhere on reddit found discussion about wide boards manufacturers and one of them even from my country and I never heard of them - LTB snowboards, producing snowboards since 1986.

Got in touch with them, borrowed 2 boards (Cutter 166 XXW with waist 286 mm and Decent 165 XXW with waist 320 mm). Tried the cutter and never even tried the Decent since the change comparing to my old board was huge and it allowed me what I was looking for. Also the Decent is so wide it looks like a doors and Lukas - LTB founder told me the day will be over after 2 rides because my legs will be on fire.

So went with the Cutter, bought NX2 binding as per James advice and spend a whole winter on this set up.

It brought me joy I was looking for and felt like I've discovered snowboarding once again. Working to get better in this by applying all the tips and tricks from James and his YT videos.

Last week I ordered Trenched Canted Risers and I'm looking already for next winter so I can keep improving my carving style.

When I'm looking at videos of you guys riding the C4, either the skills level is from different universe and miles ahead of mine or the cutter is just much stiffer and therefore I'm unable to execute such a closed turns.

On the other hand the Cutter is not carving specific snowboard and LTB doesn't offer anything carving specific. My request before purchase was that I'm looking for something I could also carve and that I ride 80% resort and 20% freeride if there are conditions for it. So something "universal".

I would like to see the C4 specs and compare with mine board. Can it be find somewhere?

Tried upload video but some error occured..

@whoeveruwant 

C4 166: 142cm effective edge, 292mm waist, 12m average sidecut

C4 162: 139cm effective edge. 286mm waist, 11m average sidecut

Coming soon?

C4 169: 144 effective edge, 300mm waist, 13m average sidecut

There has been some talk of a super-ultra-mega-wide version for a select clientele.  330mm waists or thereabouts for guys with size 13/14 boots.  Get on the waitlist to stay in the loop: www.carversconnection.com/waitlist

@wild-cherry

Oh man, this might actually be happening… Hot damn! Us “bigfeet” might finally have something to look forward to this year. Just got myself on the waiting list, super stoked to hear more details as they drop!

Woop woop!

@vospegmx-at do you maybe have any comparison of JJ C4 to some boards available in Europe like Virus X-Carve or Kessler Carver, or Nobile N8TI

I would really like to get C4, nevertheless Shipping+EU 23%VAT+duty tax probably is going to double the price.

Found some review on FB group and it seems nothing can compare to C4 🙂 :

Review by Damir:

Posted by: @piotr

↑

@vospegmx-at do you maybe have any comparison of JJ C4 to some boards available in Europe like Virus X-Carve or Kessler Carver, or Nobile N8TI

Hi Piotr, sorry, I'm not familiar with the boards you mentioned. I've been testing the SG Board, an Austrian brand, a lot, and during the tests and camps Sigi Grabner (SG)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siegfried_Grabner

organized, I learned about his ideas on board development. I like the SG Soul and the Force (even with hard boots), but both are too narrow in the waist for soft boot carving. I've always wanted to try the SG Soul XT Titan, which has an exabtable waist, but Sigi told me he developed this board for the Japanese market, so it's hard to get hold of.

The Soul felt like a Slalom board to me, with short, fast turns and very good edge grip. The Force felt even more reliable due to its longer SCR, but unfortunately, it is not possible to carve with a soft boot and high edge angle.

So I switched to the wider boards, i.e., > 28 cm waist width (...), but I don't know of any European boards for that specs. Soft-boot carving is, I think, something very exotic in Europe, but unfortunately, I don't feel comfortable in hard boots...

Posted by: @vospegmx-at

↑

Posted by: @piotr

↑

@vospegmx-at do you maybe have any comparison of JJ C4 to some boards available in Europe like Virus X-Carve or Kessler Carver, or Nobile N8TI

Hi Piotr, sorry, I'm not familiar with the boards you mentioned. I've been testing the SG Board, an Austrian brand, a lot, and during the tests and camps Sigi Grabner (SG)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siegfried_Grabner

organized, I learned about his ideas on board development. I like the SG Soul and the Force (even with hard boots), but both are too narrow in the waist for soft boot carving. I've always wanted to try the SG Soul XT Titan, which has an exabtable waist, but Sigi told me he developed this board for the Japanese market, so it's hard to get hold of.

The Soul felt like a Slalom board to me, with short, fast turns and very good edge grip. The Force felt even more reliable due to its longer SCR, but unfortunately, it is not possible to carve with a soft boot and high edge angle.

So I switched to the wider boards, i.e., > 28 cm waist width (...), but I don't know of any European boards for that specs. Soft-boot carving is, I think, something very exotic in Europe, but unfortunately, I don't feel comfortable in hard boots...

Have a look here and test.
I rode the Softbootcarver BX+ last week.
166cm length
155cm effective edge
28 cm width

https://cue-boards.de/snowboard/

@vospegmx-at I have the SG Soul 164 Titan XT board (280mm waist), with Virus Carbon Isolator risers, and the XL Flow NX2 Carbon and this is quite a setup for carving for sure.  I don't think you will be disappointed, but I have no idea how it compairs to the C4, but hope to find out in the near future when I get my own C4.  The Titan is very stiff, and wonderful to carve with, cuts like a samari sword in all conditions and it's honestly too much board for me at the moment but I'm getting there and feel inspired to dig deep trenches and improve my carving abilities, as well as play with my stance/setup, etc.  It is a heavy setup though, no joke here, it feels like it weights all together twice what my normal resort snowboard setup, the NX2 are super thick and robust. As a matter of fack I just took it with me to Japan along with my other so yeah, I am familiar with how much it all weights lugging it all around.  I almost picked up a pair of the T-Plate risers ( https://t-platejapan.com/shop/products/detail/12) during my visit, since I would skip the import tax and also qualify for the taxfree status, but didn't as they are still quite expensive (at least for the model/setup I wanted) and the carbon Virus Risers are honestly enough for me.

I bought my SG at i-carve.com ( https://i-carve.com/sg_soul_titan) and can only speak positive about the expereince, and especially Ivan.  He is really professional, had patience for all my quesitons, and was super helpful.  The delivery of the SG was itself a work of art, so yeah, can only give them 10 stars for sure and they are also located within the EU so no issues there.